Wat weet jij van de atletiek? Want ik noem het juist als hét voorbeeld dat zeker tot een jaar of 15-16 álle onderdelen aan bod komen, zeker in de training. Dat er bij wedstrijden specialisatie plaatsvindt, is niet meer dan logisch, en dus geldt dit ook voor de wedstrijdspecifieke voorbereiding. Maar in de algemenere training doet men juist allerlei onderdelen. men beseft hier heel geod, dat het jonge lichaam trainen, en ook de jonge geest, op meerdere onderdelen alleen maar goed is voor de algehele ontwikkeling. De schaatssport is dit nu ook meer en meer aan het ontdekken, als ik kijk naar het erbij pakken van shorttrack in de training, om de bochten onder de knie te krijgen. In het turnen, om nog eens wat te noemen, doet men ook allerlei onderdelen door elkaar. Waar het heel erg slecht gesteld is, is in het (betaalde!) voetbal. Daar "leidt men op" tot rechtsbuiten, verdedigende middenvelder of keeper al op heel, heel jonge leeftijd. Komt zo'n jochie nooit meer eens ergens anders te staan. Qua lichamelijke ontwikkeling valt dat nog wel mee, maar hier is het weer de ontwikkeling in tactisch denken die je daarmee schaadt: een aanvaller zou ook moeten kunnen denken als verdediger in mijn opinie. Dat er in de maatschappij meer gespecialiseerd wordt klopt helemaal, een resultaat van de almaar voortdurende schaalvergroting. Dat er in de sport meer gespecialiseerd wordt is ook een resultaat van dat we dat zelf willen: de medailles worden op die manier verdeeld. In het wielrennen is het nog omgekeerd: de winnaar van een grote ronde moet op allerlei vlak heel goed mee kunnen komen. Zelfs op afdalingen kun je die tegenwoordig verliezen
Het is wel de Nederlandse atletiek waar het (gelukkig) zo werkt. In het buitenland specialiseren degenen die echt beter zijn in een onderdeel vaak al op hun 12e.
Een oudcollega verkondigde altijd dat keepers talentloze 'voetballers' waren en dat zij daarom, uit pure armoede, keeper geworden zijn.
Maar voetbal heeft sowieso een irrationele bias richting aanvallers en aanvallende spelers. In een sport met gemiddeld 2 doelpunten per wedstrijd lijken me de keepers en verdedigers veel belangrijker. Bij een 1-0 zege (een van de meest voorkomende uitslagen) wordt in het voetbal de ene goalscorer als matchwinner geëerd terwijl de overwinning dan toch de verdienste van de achterhoede is geweest die 90 minuten lang geen (cruciale) fouten heeft gemaakt.
Nou, nog eentje dan om hem af te sluiten. Deze quote vond ik in het Schaatsseizoen 1973-1974", dus 42 jaar geleden (blz. 139) "In Zweden zijn weer eens stemmen opgegaan om het EK voor heren af te schaffen en daarvoor in de plaats individuele kampioenschappen over de diverse afstanden in te voeren, die dus ook openstaan voor rijders van buiten Europa. "Weer" schreven we, want jaren geleden lazen wij zelfde suggesties in de Nederlandse pers."
Iedere dag zet de ISU een mooie foto van het afgelopen seizoen op z'n Instagran. Vandaag is dat een foto van de Deen Lindenskov op de WCJ in Baselga. Wat is daar nou zo bijzonder aan? Nou, dit. Buitenbanen zijn een droom. Als de ISU daar indirect mee bedoelt dat meer wedstrijden op buitenbanen gehouden gaan worden, is dat een goed teken. Sowieso lijkt dat wel te gebeuren, want de komende seizoenen is er iedere keer wel één groot allroundtoernooi op een dakloze baan. 2017: EK allround en sprint in Zakopane 2018: WK allround in Amsterdam 2019: EK allround en sprint in Collalbo (zeer waarschijnlijk daar althans) Nu nog eens een World Cup senioren ipv een World Cup junioren op een buitenbaan houden en het schaatsforum is blij. Toch? Foto op Instagram: [Klik hier]
The congress resulted in an even messier calendar than before: A little bit of this an a little bit of that... I like the idea of a nostalgic championship in Amsterdam - unfortunately the idea of reviving Bislet at the moment is stone dead. What could bring alive Bislet sentiments in Norway? Our last champion was Koss in -94. A new potential champion is essential. We have had a couple since Koss, but no wins. Even more important is that allround itself need some adjustments to become more commercially interesting. The Netherlands and a few norwegians are not enough to keep it alive. Single distances are just one half of speedskating. Dont let allround die, avoid beeing too conservative. I look upon the results of this congress as temporarly, experimental solutions until the next congress. I.e. I believe (hope!) that the championship structure will look otherwise than this in a few years. The World Cup also. For me both Zakopane and Collalbo is not that exciting. A useful(?) experiment with certain values though: a three day EK event with both sprint and allround is good. But 8 distances on Saturday? Will this model result in comprehensive coverage all over Europe? No... For me a more interesting thing would be to arrange 500 and 1500 for both gender in the allround tournament on Friday, on Saturday you have the conclution of the Olympic "dreikampf" for men and women: 20 participants make the cut, and "all" pairs will be interesting because some have an advantage after day one - others of course have lacked a little bit behind. Then on Sunday you have the conclution of the classic allround with the final 4 pairs on the 10k for men and 5k for women. As for the sprinters, you have a CUP tournament on the 500 which starts out on Saturday and ends on Sunday. More exciting and commercial than to include a full sprint samalog which make it too comprehensive. If you establish a few thoughts like this, then it results in a sensibel model for the future.
In the future - in my model that is - you establish a medal award winning combination 500-1500-5000 for men, and 500-1500-3000 for women. You both have this distance combination INSIDE four distance allround tournaments (WK and partly EK), but also establish it on its own on some occations. (EK and the Olympics). Since 2007 one no longer award medals on single distances in allround tournaments. This is a functional replacement. I like the idea and momentum of a 500-1500-5000 (3000 for women) sequence best, but at the WK you rather have to stick to a 500- 5000(3000 ladies)-1500 order of the distances. I am a little bit more conservative when we speak of the WK allround I guess, and for some my thoughts are radical enough already. I will summarize my revised model here soon. Its quite simple (a good thing in this case).
Speedskating needs to sort out their championship schedule in order to receive maximum attention for a prolonged period of time on a couple of occations each season. Of course its content have to be attractive, and leaves it to the World Cup to try to fill in and attract sufficient day to day "bread and butter" interest. In the minds of people even with the slightest interest for the sport, it is rooted that speedskating have EK and WK each season, but with 4-5 World Champs (I include the juniors and the WC finals in this category) speedskating is damaging its own product. The congress saw mainly two different suggestions for a new calendar, but neither of the models were good enough. One have to be very careful in constructing in order not to destroy, but to build. One should be open-minded to different "new" suggestions of course. Here - briefly, and not elaborated in a long text this time because it is summer... - is mine. Hopefully you will understand what I mean: Year 1: EK allround including a "dreikampf" (the best word for it?). You start out with 500+1500 for both gender on Friday. 5000, (20)men and 3000, (20)women on Saturday. Sunday you finish off the classical allround with the 10k, (8)men/5k, (8)women. It is considered normal, and the dynamic way of the system, for some to step down after three distances. On Saturday you begin with the knock-out competition on the 500 for the sprinters. A competition which finishes off on Sunday. I have described the rules elsewhere. The World Champs this year is a Single Distance Championship. In self -respect at least going on from Wednesday until Sunday. Year 2: EK "dreikampf" with the longest distance last (5k, men. 3k, women) + cup sprint on the 500. Single Distance Championships on 10k, men and 5k, women. You invite the current top 3 non-europeans from the long distance world-cup also. The World Champs this year consists of World allround (with samalog champs also after 500-1500-5000/3000(women) and sprint WK. On two following week-ends and on the same location, but you can mix allround and sprint. Possibly you put in the juniors (Its samalog part) in mid-week. Another way of doing it could be a Wednesday to Sunday format. For instance: Wednesday: 500+1500, allround women + first day, sprint men. Thursday: The finish of the "dreikampf, women with 3000m + second day, sprint men. Friday: 500+1500, allround men + the finishing of classic allround for women with the 5k. Saturday: First day sprint, women + the finishing of the mens "dreikampf" with the 5k. Sunday: Second day in the womens sprint tournament + the big finale in the mens allround tournament with the 10k. Year 3: EK allround as in year 1 in this model including cup sprint on the 500. The Olympics including "dreikampf" (500-1500- 5000, men/3000, women). Year 4: About X-mas time: WK allround/sprint modelled after year 2. Second part of the season: Skating World Championship Week with single distrances, short track and possibly figure skating. A lot of intersting things could be done with the World Cup. I will mention just a few thoughts. Larger emphazis on the Grand World Cup is one key word. Those years that dont see World Allround and World Sprint Champs, you include a full allround samalog in the World Cup (possibly spread over two following week-ends). (Full sprint samalog ditto at another venue). It also gives us the preliminary nation quotas like the champs does every year now. The qualification tournament (Stavanger last season) which decides the final nation quotas also hides exciting possibilities. Make this event a personal bid for WK places. - And what about a 500+3000 combination in the world cup consisting of relatively few participants? Use either the current standings in the World Cup as qualification criteria or the latest preceding event. One should also include a cup on the 500. Same format as in the EK. Four rounds - 20 participants. World Cup as qualifier. Mass start: I know that you in the Netherlands have several different variation on this way of competing. Todays mass start in the World Champs/World Cup is OK, but could the rules be improved? I would like to see that more than just one big effort during the race is needed if you are going to achive something. What about this: Make the race longer. Make it a team event were two skaters formally team up before the start of the race. The two could either be from the same nation, commercial team (same nationality or not) or from two different countries. During the race, you have 3 intermediate sprints. The two best in each of these sprints are awarded with a ticket to be able to fight for the top spots in the race. One ticket is sufficient. During the race you frequently at certain independent elimination sprints remove the two last skaters in the field. In "the final" of the race, the field consists of 8 racers who make it to the finishing line. During the race - with the help of some kind of technological device - You immidiately illuminate the helmets of skaters that achieve a ticket at the three sprints that is decisive for winning ambitions. Do you get it? Several tactical scenarios could occur. Lets say Bergsma and Stroetinga team up, In the first "ticket sprint they are 1 and 2. In the second "ticket sprint (sic!)" Bergsma and Stroetinga for tactical reasons achieve a double again in order to prevent others to achieve tickets. In the third ticket sprint Seung Hong Lee and Contin give their respective teams a ticket-boost. The field is gradually becoming smaller, and the the final 8 occurs. Stroetinga unfortunately now at this stage has been removed since he has used too much power and ended up at the tail, but in the finish sprint Bergsma is the strongest and wins. Thus Bergsma AND Stroetinga recieves gold. (For your team mate to achive a medal, you need to fix this in the finishing sprint and your partner must stay in the race among - lets say - the last 16) In this example you end up with 3 skaters with tickets in the final 8. The number allowed to fight for the highest spots vary, others have to fight for minor placings thereafter - with a fourth at its best (even when lesser that three ticketeers make it to the final your best possible result is 4th. I.e. one can experience empty podium spots) (Ps: Feel free to comment if you want. In dutch if you prefer.)
@Kristian: why do you think less skating is better and makes more people watching it? Most people on these forums say there isn't enough skating, I've heard ideas for "Classics" in skating such as in road cycling... every year, around the same time, a certain competition, on the same track. A prestigious, but non-WK, price to win, along the already existing World Cup. That, plus a World Cup which should be made more important, creates more skating with more interesting competitions. Your idea is to have less competitions. Probably there are two/three days in a year with more attraction for skating (that one rare World Championship), but a year consists of more than 3 days...
I am not talking about less skating. I am talking about fewer championships each season to strenghten the presige of Speedskating World Championships. And I am generally taking about a call for creativity to improve events. As for EK I think three days are sufficient. I am strongly in favour of World Champs that are lasting more than 2 or three days. In order to strenghten the world cup something must happen with all the champs. I totally agree about the classics. We had a very positive arrangement i Stavanger last season, but Stavanger is not on the calendar this season. Not the way to establish a tradition. There is a World Champ in Norway though, but my guess is that people find it strange that there are more Worlds the upcoming season. What Is the highlight of the season? An EK is a preludium to WK though.
I agree with you on the matter of fewer championships. Like there are just two important sprint events; the National- and Worldchampionship but we have three Allround events; the National, European and Worldchampionship Allround, i suggest to remove the European Allround Championship. I didn't mention the World Intervals because that is a different one.
Dont forget that national championships probably only attract attention in the Netherlands. Enough attention to be live televised that is. Rest of the world are left to themselves. Move your selection drama to the world cup. Use the nationals as the first obstackle. Could be done. For me it is unwise to skip the EK. Its been there forever. The asians are not skipping theirs. Alter its content slightly instead. The success measured by number of european viewers.(I still regard the old plattforms - i.e. old fashioned television - as most impotant. Thats where you get the million views when we are talking about live sport. Other flattforms are supplementary. When national norwegian television only transmit on the net they get low figures)) The main issue at the congress was the two models concearning the World Championships. They are acknowledging that something has to be done, but havent found the solution yet. We will have to wait two more years. That time should be used.
Just mentioning to you (again?) what I mean about "a cup on the 500". In the Eurochamps - and occationally at World Cup events - you pick the 20 best from the current World Cup 500m rankings (or a preceding event). These are evenly divided into five groups of four. The lowest seed meets the highest in each group, and starts out in the outer lane in order to avoid mess up in the crossing. The third seed in each group can pick lane in their pair (?). The best skater in each group make it to the quarterfinals along with 3 "lucky loser" times among the rest. (If a skater withdraws, the best seeded left in the group will have to start alone). The four best winner-times from the five groups will be ranked in the quarterfinals (dont meet each other), and can choose lane there. Either you draw who these will meet in the quarterfinals, or it is decided in another way. (Another way of doing it, is to stick to who are the best pre-ranked before the competition, and give them favours all the way). The two best winner times in the quarterfinals dont meet each other and can choose lane in the semifinals. The best winner time in the semifinals can choose lane in the final. Single races all the way in this competition. Gold and Bronze finals. Why dont speedskating use a knock-out option like this from time to time? Higher emphasis on the man to man duel would certainly suit americans, media, audiences, tv-viewers, sponsors etc.
You could do it much easier. 32 best. First round #1 meets #32, #2 against #31. Lowest seed always outside as you said. But don't reorganize after the first round, 16 winners go to the second round. Winner of #1-#32 meets winner of #15-#16, winner of #2-#31 meets winner of #14-17. The 8 winners go to the quarter finale, then the 4 winners go to the semi finals, the 2 winners are the finalist. In total 5 rounds. 16+8+4+2+1= 31 races, could be 32 if you make a 3rd/4th-place final. Could all be done on one day. 5 races for the winner. Or spread it out over the weekend. First round Friday evening, Second round and Quarter final on Saturday evening, Semi Finals, Finals, Bronze Final on Sunday. A fun alternative for the eliminated skaters in a round could be a mass start over 500 meter for final placing. 16 losers of the First round skate mass start for place 17 to 32, 8 losers of Second round skate for place 9 to 16, etc.
Of course it could be done otherwise also, but I like the idea of some kind of group stage at first. Adds an extra dimension to it. I am sceptical to all kinds of mass starts on the 500. Too dangerous. I guess you could arrange a b-cup in some way or another for those who have been knocked out at an early stage. You could also imagine some kind of repechage system to get into the main event again. 4 or 5 racers on one day must be far to demanding. and dangerous (injuries). I have chosen 4 races over two days since thats what sprinters normally deal with. Other kind of races for the longer distances in between the rounds to provide enough resting time. I would go for a B-cup in the world cup for skaters ranked 20-40 instead for 32 partisipants in the main event. PS: I must emphasise that I in my "model" of course imagine more World Cup events than today. Higher total number of events (World Cups and Champs).
@Kristian I'm not a big fan of a knock-out system in skating. Athletics, short track, swimming... say a sport, and it quite likely has a knock-out system. Long track skating doesn't, and that makes it unique. Okay, knock-out is more interesting for Team Pursuit and probably for Team Sprint competitions, but imho not for all. In long track speed skating the guy with the fastest time wins, it has always been like that, so why change it? Adding a quarter-/semi-/final system makes it too similar too short track but more boring 'cause there are only two skaters on the track. No, there should be done more with the draw. Why is the draw in the World Cup always based on the World Cup ranking? You'd get more exciting races when the draw is just the previous competition inverted. So with this result 1. Kramer 2. Bergsma 3. Pedersen 4. Bloemen 5. Stroetinga 6. Swings the pairs for the next competition would be Stroetinga-Swings Pedersen-Bloemen Kramer-Bergsma This should create more interesting duels between skaters, and gets the skaters in shape in the last pairs. With the current system, someone who was good in the beginning of the season, but got worse later on in the season, still gets drawed in the last pairs at the end of the season. (Good example was Dutton this year). With my suggested "drawing" system, Dutton would just start in one of the first few pairs if he wasn't good enough in the previous competition. This creates more duels of skaters of the same level. And indeed, if there's one skater who wins all the time (eg Sablikova), that skater will always be in the last pair. But that's no different with the current system. A more interesting drawing system creates better "skater-to-skater-duels" without the need of a knock out system. With skaters of the same level in most pairs, a 10 km is interesting, even if not all skaters are fast enough to win the competition. (there should be a kind of advantage for winning many direct duels, a kind of combativity award as in the Tour de France. There should be something to win for skaters who aren't the world's best but are willing to fight for every meter) Also: we need Classics as in cycling, World Cup allround competitions and Olympic allrounding, but I've said that many times before here, and I've been not the only one to do so.
Why make it a significative factor for speedskating not having a knock-out competition from time to time? " Because it has always been like that"? Hmm. One of the reasons why I operate with a group stage in the beginning in the cup, is that you will get tighter and closer knock-out pairs all the way later on. "Everybody" that is calling for allround in the Olympics is always talking about the usual 4-distance tournament that we are having in the allround WK (with a possible exception that some want 10k for women also ). They will never get it! Why not 3 distances? Possible? In the beginning I was highly in favour of the knock-out system in the Team Pursuit. Now I am not so sure. It is better than the World Cup variant, but is it functional? Is this helping speedskating to remain an Olympic sport, or is it disadvantageous for the sport that it only fits in every fourth year? Use the "usual" TP in the Olympics I would say, and make way for allround (Olympic "dreikampf").
