Open letter to ISU ahead of the members conference in Leeuwarden.

K

Kristian

Well-Known Member
To ensure growth and prosperity in the future, enlarging the interest in the sport World Wide, certain amendments in the recent structure are needed. The proposal below is a subjective view, details to be discussed.

Proposal:

WC1-4: Single distances as now.

Qualification EC, 4CC, singel distances: personal qualification, and personal spots based on World Cup total points earned during World Cup 1-4. If the total quotas per distance and/or reserve spots are not filled in this way, places based on personal times achieved in approved International Competitions added. For EC: races committed in Europe. Those (possible) spots are ranked below quota places that have been secured via World Cup 1-4.

Qualification EC, allround and sprint: Either national or personal spots based on the combination of the best 1500+5,000 (3,000 women) respectively 500+1000. Results achieved from lowland events during WC1-4, with the addition of results from approved International Competitions in Europe.

EC and 4CC: European Championchips Week plus 4CC (single distances) just before Christmas.

EC-Week:

Saturday: Sprint women and men. Day 1. 3,000m, women and 5,000m, men. Single distances.

Sunday: Sprint women and men. Day 2. 1500m women and men, single distances.

Monday: rest

Tuesday: rest

Wednesday: Team Pursuit men, Team Sprint women. Mass Start women, semi-final and final. 500m, men . Starting time: 17:30

Thursday: Team Pursuit women, Team Sprint men. Mass Start men, semi-final and final. 500m, women. Starting time: 17:30

Friday: rest

Saturday: Allround women and men. Day 1. 1000m women and men, single distances.

Sunday: Allround women and men. Day 2. Single distance 10,000m, men and 5,000m, women. Those who qualify for the last distance in allround are also qualified for the individual distance. 4 additional pairs on 10,000m and 5,000m, women. Maximum 1 skater per nation in these additional pairs. Personal qualification through the World Cup.

WC 5-7: Single distances as now.

World Championships qualification, single distances: The four World Cup events before Christmas decide nation quotas in A in the first race for the distance concerned, as well as World Cup quotas in total in the second half. What applies under WC5-7 are personal qualification for the World Championships. Only qualification on points. Total World Cup points during WC5-7. WC7 is the World Cup final with A and B groups as usual. The Netherlands as an example: NK Afstanden ahead of WC5 determines who will go to the World Cup and fight for World Championship Spots. The best skaters in the NK occupy the number of places you have on the distance in question in A during the first race. Internal and external World Championship qualification via WC5-7. Such a "twist" can imply that some skaters who have done well in the World Cup before Christmas have to start in B during the first race after, or do not qualify for the second half of the World Cup.
Qualification on the longest single distance: 8 national spots based on the World Cup before Christmas (maximum one skater per nation), as well as personal places based on who qualifies in the allround competition.

World Championships qualification, allround and sprint: Personal spots based on the combination of the best 1500+5,000 (3,000 women), respectively 500+1000. Results achieved during WC 5-7, with the addition of results from approved International Competitions in those cases that the skaters are not qualified for WC5-7 for their country on both distances concerned. Just the one of them. Times noted outside WC5-7 only added in those cases when the skater doesnt compete in the World Cup on that distance. To be able to participate in the Worlds allround or sprint, one have to have participated in at least one of the distances concerned during WC 5-7.

World Championships: World Championship-"week" at the end of February, beginning of March.

Saturday: Sprint women and men. Day 1. 3,000m, women and 5,000m, men. Single distances.

Sunday: Sprint women and men. Day 2. 1500m women and men, single distances.

Monday: rest

Tuesday: rest

Wednesday: rest

Thursday: rest

Friday: rest

Saturday: rest

Sunday: rest

Monday: rest

Tuesday: rest

Wednesday: Team Pursuit men, Team Sprint women. Mass Start women, semi-final and final. 500m, men. Starting time: 17:30

Thursday: Team Pursuit women, Team Sprint men. Mass Start men, semi-final and final. 500m, women. Starting time: 17:30

Friday: rest

Saturday: Allround women and men. Day 1. 1000m women and men. Single distances.

Sunday: Allround women and men. Day 2. Single distance 10,000m, men and 5,000m,women.

Those who qualify for the last distance in allround are also qualified for the individual distance. 4 additional pairs on 10,000m, men and 5,000m, women. Maximum 1 skater per nation in these additional pairs. Only the best two from each nation count when individual distance medals are awarded for the longest.
The World Championship-"week" has two different organisers. One who takes care of the first weekend, another who takes care of the last four days. The long rest period is to ensure that skaters are not forced to prioritize one over the other, and at the same time the program cannot be too scattered when you are having the active days. This is not the Olympics with a lot of other things going on. Action and variation. There is a flexibility in the setup decribed, that makes it possible to have the World Cup final and the first World Championship weekend on another continent. In the same way, WC4 can be combined with 4CC.
Medal overview and promotion of the whole thing as ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS. The non-traditional mix between overall and single distances reinforces the feeling that you are not halfway through the Worlds when the first weekend is over, while the first weekend is still full enough.
 
Laatst bewerkt:
Further elaboration:
I envision a qualification that is mainly personal, and mainly goes via the World Cup. World Cup points in total over 3-4 events. In order to sharpen the internal and external qualification, a system is used where, for example, in the end you have to have three skaters in the top 12 in order to get three spots in the relevant class. To get two, you must have two in the top 16 (in the european Championships: both on points) . The rest is filled in with sole skaters. You should then have an opportunity to use internal reserves if these are in a position on the qualification list that allows them to. If not, the place goes to an external reserve.

I imagine that each skater per distance during the EC and WC qualification is entitled to one "Wild Card", or "reskate"-card if you like. This is to limit damage in the event of pure accidents such as falls, DQs etc. Right to have another go. There will be some extra races with such an arrangement, at the same time I imagine that one will only choose to use the opportunity in absolutely necessary cases.
 
Andere kwalificatie eisen maken de sport niet leuker. Het programma moet vooral weer beter worden. Ieder jaar een WK Sprint, WK Allround en WK Afstanden met genoeg ruimte er tussen zodat toppers aan ze allemaal mee kunnen doen. Geen EK en 4CC meer, die toernooien hebben een te lage kwaliteit deelnemersveld. Ieder jaar sowieso 1x naar Salt Lake City en naar 1-2 buitenbanen. In de world cups ieder weekend een extra 500m i.p.v. halve finales massastart. Ook een extra keer de langste afstand in de world cup (i.p.v. een 3/5km). Mogelijk teamsprint afschaffen en iets beters verzinnen.
 
Hoe zeer ik dit een mooi uitgewerkt voorstel vind, wat getuigd van je passie voor de sport, denk ik niet dat een aanpassing van het programma van ISU hier mee zou moeten beginnen.
Als je een open brief zou willen sturen naar de ISU, zou ik er eerst mee beginnen wat voor doelen er gesteld zouden moeten worden.

Bijvoorbeeld; De ISU worldcup zou bij moeten dragen aan de ontwikkeling van het schaatsen in diverse landen. Dan kun je bijv. aankaarten dat het aantal worlcup tickets per land omhoog moet, zodat het loont om aan sterkte brede selecties te bouwen. Of dat er een potje moet worden gemaakt, om worldcups te kunnen organiseren in landen waar de bonden minder financiële armslag hebben.

Of het World cup programma moet meer emoties losmaken bij de kijker. Dat je bijvoorbeeld de Team-pursuit in worldcup niet meer op de snelste tijd laat aankomen, maar dat je poulefase opzet á la europacup voetbal, en dat de winnaar van elke onderlinge wedstrijd punten krijgt. Zodat je de spanning bij het knock-outsysteem van de olympische spelen meer simuleert.

Dit zijn nou maar twee willekeurige voorbeelden hoor. Maar, eerst hetgeen forumuleren wat je graag zou willen bereiken.
 
Ohja, wat overigens best een doel zou mogen zijn, imo, is begrijpelijkere regels. Want wie snapt er in godsnaam nou nog hoe het deelnemersveld van de A-groep wordt samengesteld, met de huidige regels.
 
Thanks for your responses. I strongly believe that personal qualifications could add to the exitement and strengthen the World Cup. Just look at the dutch internal qualification races. This model is also for strenghtening both the EK, 4CC and The World Championships.

I chose not to bring all the arguments and whys in this model into the opening post.
If you look you can find several reasons to choose a path like this -- yourselves mentioning a few.
 
Laatst bewerkt:
How exactly do you see this? 'Sunday: Allround men. Day 2. Single distance 10,000m'

Do skaters like Roest, Pedersen, Swings & co have to skate a 10k twice? Probably not, they also finished a 1500 a couple of hours earlier and skated a 500 and 5000 the day before. Still a bit unfair to let them compete against the Bergsma-types starting with completely fresh legs?
 
Of course not twice. The Bergsma-thing is something one would have to accept. You expect those with fresh legs to do well -- with an open possibility that one could become a legend even winning the single distance... Maybe the bigger price would be that a couple of Ghiottos would choose the single distance, but one can live with that. Ghiotto rather being a reference than a samalog contender. I also see a difference between the EK and the WK here. One can possibly go all in in more events in the first one than in the latter.
...

The big difference seems to be that the two of you earlier above here want to abolish the EK and 4CC. If you choose to strenghten instead, it could also enable greater emphasis , and attractiveness heading into, and in the World Championships.
 
...you could simplify the rules regarding promotion and relegation in the World Cup with the new "Wild Card"-possibility described -- One could also use that as a tool to avoid relegation. -- Or to gain promotion. Tactical reskate.
 
ZeeKoei having the best objection so far.

Details can be changed in such a model. The big picture most important.
Maybe move the WK 10k, men and 5k women , singel distances to the first week end.

The last saturday one could award medals on the 5k, men and 3k, women, singel distances during the allround tournament. Would any significant skater miss out? 1000m, men and 1000m, women then on sunday instead.

Getting closer.
 
Sadly, the weak part here is the 10k, men and the 5k, women. Single distances
Either remove or move seems to be the options.
 
Do you want the World Championship "week" (which is more like 2+ weeks) to be on the same ice rink?
 
No, could even be on two continents. See above. Problem is where to put the 10k, men and 5k, women. Cant alter allround and have single distance awards simultainousl on 5k, men and 3k, women. Would spoil the attractive qualification system I am taking about.

By the way: on my way to Leeuwarden by train right now. Nice days of watching skating ahead! :)
 
To be honest, I don't get the ISU urge to squeeze everything into one week.
A separate World Champs for allround and single distances in three months of winter should be possible, no?
This season was one of the most boring seasons ever. If they want their fans to lose interest, this is the way to go.
 
I stick to the proposed program regarding the EK. Being the EK, I think a few skaters will have a go for the allround tournament, with the extra chance of getting something out of the longest distance. I.e. that the popularity for the established allround event would be greater than the "new" single distance. -- that Ghiotto would not choose only to participate on the 10k. Second thought told me: It WILL be a weakening if we miss out the Ghiottos in allround...

European Championships. Containing everything.
4CC. (Not containing everything, but more realistic that way)

WK-"week": I guess a solution here would be to move the 10k, men and the 5k, women single distances to the open saturday in between. I imagine that this placing is not ideal, and that the Roests then possibly would skip the TP, but OK.
As for the last weekend, 1000m, women single distance on saturday. 1000m, men single distance on sunday.

World Speed Skating Championships. Containing everything.

...
 
We have had the World Cup for ages. It really needs refreshing. The ISU try to oblige those who get Championships to arrange World Cups. Should rather be the other way: I think the poles put up a very nice show during the World Cup finals. Imagine my model, and how they then arrange the first WK-weekend. Then move on to Thialf.
...

Qualification as a tool to make the World Cup more attractive to arrange, and for the hosts, viewer, skater, sponsors and media.
EK-, and WK-weeks to enlarge the interest in the sport. Reinforced efforts to establish the 4CC.
...

The reason we went from three WKs with big space between them to one (or two...) was to secure attention: All eyes on speed skating when they had their ONLY WK of the season! The evaluation must be that the seasons have become more anemic. It is doubtful that the interest for the sport has risen.
Quickly, after the new solution, the member federations urged to have WSD every season, but something is still missing:
We miss suspense and build up to definitive highlights -- not so much the dutch because you have your internal qualification races, but still you miss WK-allround and WK-sprint. Then imagine the rest of us!
 
Ik denk dat we gewoon eerlijk moeten zijn. Het redden van het EK allround in 2016, door ook nog eens een EK sprint én EK afstanden te introduceren, is een slechte zet geweest. Landen van de andere werelddelen kwamen toen vanuit de bonden met het plan voor een 4CC en dat werd vervolgens aangenomen. Echter nemen de meeste landen dit toernooi niet serieus. Tel uit je winst! Wat vervolgens gebeurde is dat het management van de ISU het plan van de om en om EK/WK's dus koste wat kost wilde doorzetten. Hoewel dat m.b.t. de WK's nog werd tegengehouden door de bonden. Daardoor zitten we nu met een enorm versnipperd programma en heeft men de schaatsers nog meer tegen zich gekregen. Het WK afstanden en de Olympische Spelen profiteren hiervan omdat die toernooien niets in de weg wordt gelegd.

Het niveau in de breedte van de afgelopen EK's maakt wel duidelijk dat dit toernooi wel zijn langste tijd heeft gehad. Er zullen nu eens harde keuzes gemaakt moeten worden i.p.v. iedereen maar een beetje te vriend te willen houden. Dus kap nu eens met EK en 4CC!
Voer een jaarlijkse allround/sprint vierkamp in wat niet onder de naam WK hoeft en dan maak je veel schaatsers weer blij. Versterk de World Cup door meer wedstrijden te rijden en betere en flexibele (top B groep) puntentellingen waardoor men allerlei uitzonderingen (wild cards, eerste drie blijven in A groep) het raam uit kan gooien.

Voor wat betreft het programma van het WK denk ik dat je er bij het management van de ISU nooit een plan doorkrijgt waarin een lang programma over meer dan een week staat. Dat heeft Ard Schenk jaren geleden al eens voorgesteld en dat hebben ze in de onderste la van het bureau gedumpt. We zullen er mee moeten leven dat men vast houd aan een compact programma van hooguit vier dagen. Hooguit zou je de team pursuit en team sprint eruit kunnen halen en de WK titels dan bij de World Cup finale verdelen.
 
Dunno all the dutch language here, but anyways here are my opinions.

Please remove EM and Teamsprint from the programme. No one cares about EM anymore. Teamsprint is also very boring.

Introduce VM allround and single distance every year.

Yearly competitions in Salt Lake City or Urumqi must be mandatory. A season with world record races is always more fun.

Include russians and belarussians when they stop attacking ukraine.

Make speed skating great in new countries. Portugal, Estonia, Ukraine, Denmark, Chile, Kenya, Nepal, New Zealand, England, Iceland etc.
 
Sprintmaster: You forget that one of the things with the WK-"week" above, is that its not held on the same location -- and its not a "week" either.
Flexibility. Still one WK istead of two or three AND containing all. Have a look again :The first week end in fact being the former sprint-WK with the addition of some single distances. The latter part of the glue that tie it together if you like .
 
I should add that I have a different model in hand (possibly without EK and 4CC) which I have spoken about several times. That one have Allround- sprint WK of today in the end of the first half, and the WSD at the end of the second. -- But that one is more difficult to implement.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top